tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6296804278155339345.comments2011-10-19T08:50:54.686-06:00Scott's thoughts - Cogito ergo sumScotthttp://www.blogger.com/profile/06255308169233509181noreply@blogger.comBlogger94125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6296804278155339345.post-79917609362023200972011-10-19T08:50:54.686-06:002011-10-19T08:50:54.686-06:00Hey Jeff,
The book goes through historic doubters ...Hey Jeff,<br />The book goes through historic doubters of all traditions, east to west. I found the Muslim doubters fascinating. So I think with this survey at the beginning of the book, it's not so much doubt within a persons specific religious tradition, but overall doubt, and being able to find common ground with others. So you and a follower of a different tradition might have doubts about your specific style of faith, but not the basic philosophy that supports it. Make sense? I personally think everyone has to be an agnostic, and then they live on one side or the other, but this quiz doesn't really allow for that sort of subtly either. Thanks for your answer, appreciate it.Scotthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06255308169233509181noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6296804278155339345.post-80296843690389211862011-10-18T23:47:52.910-06:002011-10-18T23:47:52.910-06:00Results: I am a believer. No surprise there espec...Results: I am a believer. No surprise there especially seeing as how the quiz doesn't really provide any significant ways for a people to express that they may have doubts about some aspects of any of their beliefs. There's plenty of aspects of my beliefs that I'm not sure about, but those thoughts/doubts don't seem to be captured by this survey.Jeff Richardshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04565640340089909898noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6296804278155339345.post-70449792035942415622011-01-19T20:03:31.758-07:002011-01-19T20:03:31.758-07:00Hey Jeff,
You were my first call, I left a message...Hey Jeff,<br />You were my first call, I left a message.<br />Glad you enjoyed your first venture :) They are pretty fun. He definitely gets better as he figures his world out. Keep reading, they're worth it.Scotthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06255308169233509181noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6296804278155339345.post-5839889088435610462011-01-19T19:46:57.635-07:002011-01-19T19:46:57.635-07:00Well, I certainly won't be the first to cast a...Well, I certainly won't be the first to cast a stone on the too late for a holiday greeting as I really haven't yet sent Christmas cards. Although I did receive and appreciate yours! You guys are so good at that!<br /><br />In other news I finally read my first discworld novel "The Light Fantastic" it was a fun read. Took me a grand total of 2 days to finish. Which is a good sign as I'm usually a very slow reader! I would describe my first discworld read as... amusing, I had a couple snicker-out-loud moments. Stangely, s-o-l hasn't caught on as an acronymn like l-o-l. <br /><br />And finally, I love your resolution, I am attempting to do likewise.Jeff Richardshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04565640340089909898noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6296804278155339345.post-32261207977764415562010-11-22T15:32:50.318-07:002010-11-22T15:32:50.318-07:00Reminds me of the SMBC sperm injection comic. Love...Reminds me of the SMBC sperm injection comic. Love the xkcd.Barry L.https://www.blogger.com/profile/10961232390319471821noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6296804278155339345.post-10969689264742512872010-07-12T14:41:43.826-06:002010-07-12T14:41:43.826-06:00Ok. That was great, and I hadn't seen it :)
C...Ok. That was great, and I hadn't seen it :)<br /><br />Cheers,<br /><br />ChrisMr. Neufeldhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08030173601688513482noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6296804278155339345.post-72822536747201899132010-07-12T13:17:03.357-06:002010-07-12T13:17:03.357-06:00No worries, you don't always have to post. I l...No worries, you don't always have to post. I like Penn, he seems genuine. <br />I am guessing you already acknowledge that people are not uncaused causers, at least in a minor way, otherwise you would deny the idea that a brain tumour could change behaviour. If you have time, listen to the podcast. There is data to support some claims, they do talk a bit about neuroscience. As well, you can make a logical arguments without physical evidence. Do you think nothing is A priori? They seem to think the evidence is in on determinism, but I don't know enough yet to know whether I should agree or disagree. I kind of get your second point, but don't really know why deism got raised.<br />Thanks for the comment.<br />Cheers,<br />SScotthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06255308169233509181noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6296804278155339345.post-34396534816862918692010-07-11T00:03:01.156-06:002010-07-11T00:03:01.156-06:00Thanks Scott, that clip was great. Took me back to...Thanks Scott, that clip was great. Took me back to my childhood - so mind-numbingly bored in Church Mum & Dad let me read the Bible. I've lost count how many times I read it - eventually I started writing down the 'interesting' passages and that was the Beginning of the End. It was the children torn apart by bears that still sticks in my mind.<br /><br />The idea that we are not uncaused causers doesn't make sense to me, but neither does the idea that we are uncaused causers. Complicated philosophical discussions in the absence of data always seems a bit too much like self-gratification. It's fun, it passes the time, but in the end nothing really important is accomplished. (Give me an Engineer any day : http://instantlyviral.blogspot.com/2010/05/saturday-morning-breakfast-cereal_12.html ).<br /><br />It's a bit like the discussion on whether or not the mere existence of a universe that allows life is itself evidence - with absolutely no data to compare it to. It might mean something. It might not. But at the end of the day, it definitely doesn't mean that a prophet rode a flying horse, or a God was sacrificed for sins, or killing beetles is wrong. Deism isn't theism, and Deists seem a lot like atheists, but with a soft spot for religious awe. I find it odd when theists use Deist arguments for the existence of God - don't they know that completely destroys their Theistic faith-based God? Deism was, above all, based on rationality (even if I think their conclusions were wrong, they certainly weren't intended to be faith-based).<br /><br />I read your posts, even if I don't always comment - sorry for missing the last few. End of year is always very busy!<br /><br />Cheers,<br /><br />rcnMr. Neufeldhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08030173601688513482noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6296804278155339345.post-70929453413230566202010-07-09T08:38:14.232-06:002010-07-09T08:38:14.232-06:00That's a good question, and something to think...That's a good question, and something to think about. One of the reasons I like Sagan. Wish you were in town, and we could have some beer and discuss it.<br />I think I have a few worthy goals, but I don't crave "some cosmic purpose". I think increased knowledge is a worthy goal, leaving the things better than when you found them. I've recently listened to some podcasts on free will and determinism and it's left me thinking more compassion is a good idea. <br />http://doubtreligion.blogspot.com/2009/01/episode-29-free-willy-vs-determinator.html<br />Anyways, I'm going to give the question some more thought.Scotthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06255308169233509181noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6296804278155339345.post-11957256194125209262010-07-09T08:13:11.776-06:002010-07-09T08:13:11.776-06:00What is YOUR worthy goal, my good friend?What is YOUR worthy goal, my good friend?Matthew Foxhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12369188992116893512noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6296804278155339345.post-76963557079403005082010-06-25T00:27:53.308-06:002010-06-25T00:27:53.308-06:00Thanks for the tips on the podcasts. I have been ...Thanks for the tips on the podcasts. I have been enjoying a few podcasts at work as I code, mind you I try and get music podcasts as the too much talk starts distracting me... I've been enjoying the horrendously cheezy radio3 r3-30 and radio3 grant lawrence podcasts.<br /><br />As for stubbornness it's definitely an issue. It occurs to be it may be almost inherent in holding any hard to prove idea. In the case of religion or as yet unproven points of science, basically you have to be the convinced that you're on the right track and then hone one's understanding of the unprovable part through hunches, testing and experience (theory). <br /><br />An interesting question would be is stubborn belief a regular precursor of discovery? The term mad scientist exists for a reason :)Jeff Richardshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04565640340089909898noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6296804278155339345.post-84358278898457875212010-06-23T16:35:59.404-06:002010-06-23T16:35:59.404-06:00Good point.Good point.Scotthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06255308169233509181noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6296804278155339345.post-6230309554146618892010-06-21T00:23:43.005-06:002010-06-21T00:23:43.005-06:00They're both great apes, so the question might...They're both great apes, so the question might be thus: who is anthropomorphizing more?Kylehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16697374844414261485noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6296804278155339345.post-74909466267980114582010-05-16T01:19:11.002-06:002010-05-16T01:19:11.002-06:00Woah!Woah!Mr. Neufeldhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08030173601688513482noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6296804278155339345.post-71195578675917507622010-05-01T14:29:08.555-06:002010-05-01T14:29:08.555-06:00I agree that the whole seeds that won't produc...I agree that the whole seeds that won't produce more seeds seems evil. I think it's one of those things where people get mad, but don't realize the subtle difference between getting mad at the "hammer" or getting mad at the person swinging the "hammer".<br />As to who to trust, I would say things with a small amount of evidence, I trust little. IE "cold fx', no real evidence, no real trust. Vaccines, vast amount of evidence, much more trust. The more conclusive peer review, the more studies across a range of areas/publications, the more I would trust. Basically b/c that has been shown to work well so far. We've built bridges, wiped out diseases, it's not perfect, but it's the best we've got. The more results the better. <br />I just finished a book called 'Predictably Irrational', which I think matches well with his book. <br />You have a good point, it's not easy knowing who to trust, which is why I would say healthy skepticism is the way to go.Scotthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06255308169233509181noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6296804278155339345.post-89180793691077381472010-05-01T09:32:51.609-06:002010-05-01T09:32:51.609-06:00Interesting talk! He certainly makes a strong cas...Interesting talk! He certainly makes a strong case for genetically modified food (and not burying one's head in the sand on the big issues). I appreciate that he points out that the a lot of the problems of genetically modified foods aren't in fact the idea that they have been modified but are related to how we grow them and use them. I think the one example of really heinous genetically modifications is the idea of making seeds that are unable to produce more seeds, so that the growers are forever dependent on the manufacturers of the seed. That seems really wrong to me. <br /><br />He did touch on some of the reasons that people have lost faith in the institutions which I think is really the big problem in people's perceptions. "I can't believe you because: a) you were wrong before and didn't come clean in a timely and faith maintaining way b) you make money if I believe you so you are probably motivated to make me believe this by the profit motive and not for my own best interest"<br /><br />== Getting on Soapbox ==<br /><br />One of the fundamental problems that he completely misses is that of who to believe. He simply says that we should examine the facts. Great. let me put my life on hold while I examine the facts on each and every vaccine, vitamin supplement, genetically modified food, etc. do some statistical analysis on the studies (if there are any) and make a careful consideration as to whether their results are valid, conforming to proper scientific methods and... oh wait that means I'll need to be familiar with the proper scientific research methods for biology, chemistry, organic chemistry... and then there's the trouble of whether people are telling the truth about their results... in teh cases where there is only a few studies and I can't infer truth by similar results in unconnected studies I pretty much need to review the records of test to make sure they aren't fudging the results a little. I'm afraid I don't have the time. So this suggestion is not going to be workable. <br /><br />Which I think brings in a part that he didn't address in his video, but is equally important (maybe it's in the book) which is understanding who to believe. Honestly, I think that most of us are working a lot more strongly off the web of trust model, because the institutionally based trust model has seen such heavy damage Too many doctors giving advice when they only have a PhD in creative writing :). And everyone calls themselves engineer (except me, although I wouldn't mind being in a position, where the term engineer would properly apply :). <br /><br />Anyways, I would have like to hear who he chooses to believe, how he judges which studies are good which are invalid. Who he chooses to trust etc. Cause in the world of more information than a person can possibly parse that is one of the big problems related to trying to act wisely. That's one of the reasons I think we're seeing a shift towards more organic thinking on the genetically modified food front. People feel like they can trust it, it's not new. (The vaccine thing I agree is completely crazy)<br /><br />== Getting off soapbox ==<br /><br />uh oh I wrote a novel.Jeff Richardshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04565640340089909898noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6296804278155339345.post-38052622681790984002010-03-21T19:03:03.325-06:002010-03-21T19:03:03.325-06:00I would suggest that you have a look at some of th...I would suggest that you have a look at some of the works here:<br /><br />http://www.historicalapologetics.com<br /><br />Consider this a donation.Timhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09752886510692318211noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6296804278155339345.post-64034372457830328672010-03-11T22:16:01.805-07:002010-03-11T22:16:01.805-07:00"I believe in God, but I don't think God ..."I believe in God, but I don't think God exists."<br /><br />Funny - sounded like Shermer :)<br /><br />A lot of people don't seem to *really* believe in God, but they believe in belief in God.<br /><br />Cheers,<br /><br />ChrisMr. Neufeldhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08030173601688513482noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6296804278155339345.post-34365581746979987442010-02-03T19:02:40.401-07:002010-02-03T19:02:40.401-07:00Man, it is a real challenge. I tend to get wrappe...Man, it is a real challenge. I tend to get wrapped up in my ideas emotionally as well. The best techinques I've found so far are two a) keep smiling and being friendly and just avoid the attacking angle and b) go for a more "I'm trying to understand your point of view" angle. Not in the sense that I'm inclined to just let them talk and talk and talk, but in the sense that at the point where their position ceases to make sense (or ceases to make sense given their initial assumpmtion) a point of question or clarification could be raised. I mean, really, even the leaders at an alpha course haven't thought this stuff through from all angles. <br /><br />Occasionally, there are points that you can agree on, pointing those out helps keep the conversation constructive.Jeff Richardshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04565640340089909898noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6296804278155339345.post-32779369379346121242010-02-02T09:23:23.800-07:002010-02-02T09:23:23.800-07:00Thanks for the comments guys. Sorry about the comm...Thanks for the comments guys. Sorry about the comment box being so annoying. <br /><br />Tim - end goal would probably to know the truth of something, or at least more of it. <br /><br />Ron - Ya, I was kind of thinking the same thing. I am still trying to figure out how to say "Homeopathy is bullshit" and not make enemies.<br /><br />Jeff - I really like the idea of not having a me versus them situation. How do you do that when people, myself included, get emotionally attached to our beliefs and ideas?Scotthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06255308169233509181noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6296804278155339345.post-87507771678069345042010-01-30T09:26:11.014-07:002010-01-30T09:26:11.014-07:00I think that there is a strong possibility for som...I think that there is a strong possibility for some one to bring a positive attitude to thinking critically. Does disagreeing necessarily equate to negativity? I don't think so. Can politicians of different strips be friendly in spite of their fundamental differences in how they would govern. I think so, at least the civil ones can.<br /><br />I've been working on learning the fine art of being able to disagree with a smile on my face. The long term goal is to be able to completely disagree without be-littling (I have been wrong before) and without setting up an me versus them situation (aiming for a this idea versus that idea situation) so that we can talk about the ideas without either party having to feel entirely on the defensive.<br /> Joanna is helping me learn this! :)<br /><br />PS does it bother anyone else that this comment box doesn't let you use the arrow keys to move around? Even the home and end key don't work for me. GahJeff Richardshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04565640340089909898noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6296804278155339345.post-76270005620355946692010-01-29T00:48:25.359-07:002010-01-29T00:48:25.359-07:00Being critical gets a bad rap. And the 'being ...Being critical gets a bad rap. And the 'being critical makes you bitter' comment gets a little tiring - it's rarely being critical that makes you bitter, but finding out you've been lied can make you very bitter (ex-scientologists seem very bitter indeed).<br /><br />Your private notes were critical - and she was worried? Focusing on the positive sounds more like an attribute of a belief meme. Beliefs that cannot stand up to criticism will only survive if its members discourage criticism. Either its members naturally adopt non-critical attributes, or the belief dies out.<br /><br />Of course, if it was the context that the positive was being ignored at the expense of the negative, there may be a point. Those that reject vaccines and modern medicine because Doctors are impatient and Pharmaceutical companies focus on profit would be an example.<br /><br />There may be nothing to be positive about. Someone's telling me all about how drug companies control the world, modern medicine doesn't work, and how homeopathy is the way to go - I'm finding it difficult to find anything positive to say for any common ground whatsoever.<br /><br />Alpha sounds like Bible study. Uncritical Bible study by the very nature of the topics - evidence of Christianity? Really? They said that with a straight face?<br /><br />It's probably a good thing nobody invites me :). I like your summaries, critical or not.<br /><br />Cheers,<br /><br />ChrisRonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13231337707410008970noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6296804278155339345.post-53707695022242291192010-01-29T00:45:36.015-07:002010-01-29T00:45:36.015-07:00This comment has been removed by the author.Ronhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13231337707410008970noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6296804278155339345.post-33442170768679852332010-01-28T20:12:05.856-07:002010-01-28T20:12:05.856-07:00Well Scotty, that's some good self reflection....Well Scotty, that's some good self reflection. I would say that you have a tendancy to be critical ... not overly critical about everything, unless you felt you were being led by the nose perhaps. It was always tough trying to do that (not that I ever did). <br /><br />But I believe that there is great benefit to THINKING CRITICALLY, not just BEING CRITICAL. (Sorry, I'd use italics but I don't have the option with this thing.) I do my best to view every detail and circumstance and nuance and statement through a lense of critical thinking. This is not a self serving end, it's to legitimately know the truth of whatever it is I'm digesting - whereas I believe bitterness is self serving - it's an emotional means of revenge over something that you felt damaged you that will never end if you continue feeding it. Thinking critically can be coupled with loving deeply. Bitterness excludes love saying, in particular people or circumstances, that love is only second best. <br /><br />I think you can write critical thoughts. But what's your motive? What's your end goal Scotty?Tim Larsonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17128449821449198487noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6296804278155339345.post-62933674409230667942010-01-20T22:08:29.795-07:002010-01-20T22:08:29.795-07:00Thanks Ryan, I was hoping you would comment. I fig...Thanks Ryan, I was hoping you would comment. I figured you would have some issues with the list. <br />I also hope it's worth it.<br />Thanks for the input. I'll see about those books.Scotthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06255308169233509181noreply@blogger.com